How small we are

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10-25-2009, 10:38 AM
ndakotan

How small we are

Just ran across some pics of how small our little corner of the universe is. Reading about the diameters of objects doesn't quite put it into perspectiveas seeing it: <img src="http://www.ericptak.com/emails-and-forwards/wp-uploads/The_Size_Of_Our_World/01.jpg" alt="image"> <img src="http://www.ericptak.com/emails-and-forwards/wp-uploads/The_Size_Of_Our_World/02.jpg" alt="image"> <img src="http://www.ericptak.com/emails-and-forwards/wp-uploads/The_Size_Of_Our_World/03.jpg" alt="image"> <img src="http://www.ericptak.com/emails-and-forwards/wp-uploads/The_Size_Of_Our_World/04.jpg" alt="image"> <img src="http://www.ericptak.com/emails-and-forwards/wp-uploads/The_Size_Of_Our_World/05.jpg" alt="image">
10-25-2009, 10:54 AM
patwheels

THat's cool, thanks! Pat
10-25-2009, 11:04 AM
Striderxl

Wow now I have to go buy a BIG GUN or a very expensive SPORTS CAR. Thanks alot.
10-25-2009, 11:58 AM
usastreetrodder

Velly interesting.........
10-25-2009, 01:42 PM
Charger68

COOL!!!!! And to think we are it in the universe??? LOLOLOL!!!!
10-25-2009, 01:57 PM
Spoilersnut

Yeah! It's truly amazing <img src="http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/eek.gif"> How our little but very pretty "Blue Marble" is lost among our other giant planets.But consider just how lost we TRULY ARE in the Universal way of thinking! <img src="http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/eek.gif"><img src="http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/eek.gif"><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v295/spoilersnut/Ultradeepfieldpic.jpg" alt="image">The Ultra Deep Field contains an estimated 10,000 galaxies ... All Galaxies! It blows the mind doesn't it! <img src="http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/eek.gif">This, of coarse is just a small piece of what's out there. Explore! It's Human Nature! <img src="http://www.dodgetalk.com/forums/images/smilies/banana.gif">Thanks for sharing <img src="http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/happy.gif">Lance
10-25-2009, 02:39 PM
BRepine

Space the final frontier........
10-25-2009, 02:46 PM
PeepingScott

SIZE MATTERS
10-25-2009, 02:55 PM
99octane

<blockquote> toysalot wrote: <hr><blockquote> I know it's unproven, and might never ever to able to be proven, but I would put all my money on YES, there is life outside our galaxy. </blockquote>And you would lose...<img alt="image" src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/wink.gif"> Nice gamble though. <blockquote> Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence in this case. </blockquote>If your statement above is true, prove it! Some people want to believe in the unknown. Many people do...I don't. I make decisions on what I can see or prove to be real. I have never wished upon a star...if you want to...that's OK too...<img alt="image" src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/thumbsup.gif"> </blockquote> The statement is one of probabilities, not conclusion of fact. The probability is there, it is true. "Some people want to believe in the unknown. Many people do...I don't. " That's admirable, I feel the same way. It's not a matter of "believing" anything, it's a matter of understanding the scope of the probability of there being life elsewhere vs. the idea that ONLY on our one world did life ever exist. The factors of that equasion have been addressed earlier and not just by me! It has nothing to do with "wishing".
10-25-2009, 03:58 PM
toysalot

<blockquote> SIZE MATTERS</blockquote> Sure doesn't look like SIZE MATTERS as there have been no signs of life found on any other orbiting orbs...right?
10-25-2009, 04:31 PM
99octane

Toysalot, What kind of life? Basic bacterial like organisms or creatures with intelligence and even technology? If it's basic simple life you mean, there may have been such life on Mars, right next door. Not confirmed, but tantalizing evidence of it has been found. Some of Saturn and Jupiter's moons have the potential for simple life too. Life, as amazing as it is, is merely a function of chemistry - given enough time and the right ingredients. But for complex life ... we can't do much more than confirm the existence of other planets around other stars right now, (and this is within the past 20 years!), let alone determine their climate. Our search for extra terrestrial intelligence is limited by our current level of technology and understanding of life, which is largely limited to carbon based Earth-bound life. Keep in mid the farthest we've ever been is our moon, the farthest any of our probes has gone is a now dead Voyager II, launched in 1977, which is about 1% of the way to the nearest star about now. The farthest any of our radio waves have traveled is about 76 light years in all directions away from Earth. (The 1933 Olympics held in Berlin was the first event broadcast with enough power to sustain a coherent artificial radio signal out in to space). That means that the Earth is dead center in a spherical ball 152 light years in diameter of artificial radio noise we've been making since about 1933. That's how far OUR radio noise has traveled. For any intelligent space-faring creatures were to detect us, they or their instruments would have to be within that 152 light year sphere of our radio noise...assuming they'd even care or be monitoring radio waves. Seems like a big area, doesn't it? A sphere of human radio & TV broadcasts 152 light years across? This Galaxy is 100,000 (one hundred thousand) light years across. Not such a big fraction afterall. Also, if an intelligent alien race with technology were broadcasting, our ability to detect it is limited by when they started broadcasting, and from where, and if the technology is even known to us. The enormity of time and space all but guarantees that there is life elsewhere, but the spans of time and space between such life will likely keep each ignorant of the other. Greg
10-25-2009, 04:35 PM
Charger68

Only in our finite solar system........... And the jury is still out on a lot of those! To even try and say we are it??? Wow............ Signs of life.....Would we even know what to look for, does it all have to be carbon based, is water really necessary for life?? I dunno........ Greg is the guy to come up withall of the web sites supporting, or disproving the many theories..... But you trust the knowledge of MAN to make a positive statement like that?? Hell, through advancing technology we are finding new species of plant and animallife right in our own back yard on a daily basis and we can't even figure out a way to get man past the moon and it's doubtful that may ever happenagain!! And?? Who says we haven't found life? Do ya think we would be privy to such world changing knowledge?
10-25-2009, 05:27 PM
sverrefehn

<blockquote> And?? Who says we haven't found life? Do ya think we would be privy to such world changing knowledge?</blockquote>Yes!! An X-files angle right there.........you know how I love my X-files.
10-25-2009, 05:33 PM
toysalot

<blockquote> Toysalot, What kind of life?</blockquote> Life like us...a civilization that sustains life and survives and breathes air like we do. Human or another like being that builds things and makes things andcreates life structures etc. You know...LIFE! Nothing proven and many many many IFs don't count in my book. 'If this' and 'If that' could be said for many many educated guesses butnothing has been proven
10-25-2009, 06:04 PM
PeepingScott

I know it's unproven, and might never ever to able to be proven, but I would put all my money on YES, there is life outside our galaxy. Why wouldn'tthere be? We are so small in a vast universe... We could argue about it, but it can't be proven either way. I'd put my money on "Life Beyond"...<img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/alien.gif" alt="image">
10-25-2009, 06:06 PM
sverrefehn

Humming the X-files theme music right now. (Greg is chuckling to himself somewhere.)
10-25-2009, 06:09 PM
99octane

<blockquote> toysalot wrote: <hr><blockquote> Toysalot, What kind of life? </blockquote> Life like us...a civilization that sustains life and survives and breathes air like we do. Human or another like being that builds things and makes things and creates life structures etc. You know...LIFE! Nothing proven and many many many IFs don't count in my book. 'If this' and 'If that' could be said for many many educated guesses but nothing has been proven </blockquote> Ok, intelligent life is what you meant. (Trees and bugs are life too, by the way, you know, "life" LOL) I answered that the best I could, but you seem to be a skeptic as to whether or not other intelligent life exists or ever existed in this vast universe. That's cool, but if I'm right and you ARE taking a view that since it's unproven it means there isn't any, I hope at least you realize the scope of our ignorance outweighs the scope of our knowledge by a factor of trillions to one! (See my earlier post) Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence in this case.
10-25-2009, 06:13 PM
PeepingScott

<img src="http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y103/ScottWheels/xfiles023.jpg" alt="image"> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/JDZBgHBHQT8&rel=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355" allowscriptaccess="never"></embed>
10-25-2009, 06:16 PM
Phildirt

The enormity of time and space all but guarantees that there is life elsewhere, but the spans of time and space between such life will likely keep each ignorant of the other. .. I think God planned it that way on purpose.
10-25-2009, 06:33 PM
99octane

<blockquote> Phildirt wrote: <hr> The enormity of time and space all but guarantees that there is life elsewhere, but the spans of time and space between such life will likely keep each ignorant of the other. .. I think God planned it that way on purpose. </blockquote> That is an entirely different conversation.
10-25-2009, 06:56 PM
toysalot

<blockquote> I know it's unproven, and might never ever to able to be proven, but I would put all my money on YES, there is life outside our galaxy.</blockquote>And you would lose...<img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/wink.gif" alt="image"> Nice gamble though. <blockquote> Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence in this case.</blockquote>If your statement above is true, prove it! Some people want to believe in the unknown. Many people do...I don't. I make decisions on what I can see or prove to be real. I have never wished upon a star...if you want to...that's OK too...<img src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/thumbsup.gif" alt="image">
10-25-2009, 07:13 PM
99octane

There is a very famous equation in Astronomy / Cosmology that deals with the very question of are there / how many are there intelligent civilizations in this galaxy. It's called the Drake Equation. <a target="_blank" href="http://www.activemind.com/Mysterious/Topics/SETI/drake_equation.html">http://www.activemind.com/Mysterious/Topics/SETI/drake_equation.html</a> And yes, it has a LOT of "ifs", so you probably won't care for it, but the suppositions are sound. Again, this is about probability, not "wishing" or "belief". Greg
10-25-2009, 07:32 PM
CHEVY57

<blockquote> 99octane wrote: Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence in this case.</blockquote> Funny that is the same thing that scientists say about God......... If you can't prove that there is a God, then there isn't one. But it's OK to believe in the existence of intelligent life? What a crock!
10-25-2009, 07:34 PM
CHEVY57

If there is No proof, then probability simply becomes belief.
10-25-2009, 07:39 PM
toysalot

Interesting read...The Drake Equation. Has it outlined like a mathematical equation but mathematics can be proven. However...The title is 'The Mysterious & Unexplained. Still...nothing proven...<img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/wink.gif" alt="image">
10-25-2009, 07:41 PM
99octane

<blockquote> CHEVY57 wrote: <hr><blockquote> 99octane wrote: Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence in this case. </blockquote> Funny that is the same thing that scientists say about God......... If you can't prove that there is a God, then there isn't one. But it's OK to believe in the existence of intelligent life? What a crock!</blockquote> No, not a crock at all Pete. And that's why I added the qualifier "in this case". <img src="http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/wink.gif"> The two conversations are apples and oranges. We know there is all this space out there, we know the distances and the time involved. We just don't know if / where the life is and how advanced it may be.
10-25-2009, 07:43 PM
99octane

<blockquote> toysalot wrote: <hr> Still...nothing proven...<img alt="image" src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/wink.gif"> </blockquote>I never once said there was anything proven regarding life on other worlds. Not once. But how does that fact disprove it to you?
10-25-2009, 07:49 PM
toysalot

<blockquote> I never once said there was anything proven regarding life on other worlds. Not once.</blockquote>Exactly... "Defense rests"
10-25-2009, 07:57 PM
99octane

<blockquote> toysalot wrote: <hr><blockquote> I never once said there was anything proven regarding life on other worlds. Not once. </blockquote>Exactly... "Defense rests" </blockquote> HUH? You seem confused! <img src="http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif"> That's like saying "I don't have a case your honor, therefore I win"
10-25-2009, 08:00 PM
Charger68

<blockquote> toysalot wrote: <hr><blockquote> I never once said there was anything proven regarding life on other worlds. Not once. </blockquote>Exactly... "Defense rests" </blockquote> Defense?? You didn't even make it to the STAND!!!!!
10-25-2009, 08:08 PM
1Perry

Cool pics. As far as the rest.......I don't care.
10-25-2009, 08:11 PM
toysalot

<img src="http://forums.gottadeal.com/images/smilies/rotflol.gif" alt="image"><img src="http://forums.gottadeal.com/images/smilies/rotflol.gif" alt="image"><img src="http://forums.gottadeal.com/images/smilies/rotflol.gif" alt="image"> <img src="http://forums.gottadeal.com/images/smilies/rotflol.gif" alt="image"><img src="http://forums.gottadeal.com/images/smilies/rotflol.gif" alt="image"><img src="http://forums.gottadeal.com/images/smilies/rotflol.gif" alt="image"> <img src="http://forums.gottadeal.com/images/smilies/rotflol.gif" alt="image"><img src="http://forums.gottadeal.com/images/smilies/rotflol.gif" alt="image"><img src="http://forums.gottadeal.com/images/smilies/rotflol.gif" alt="image"> Cubed baby...cubed!
10-25-2009, 08:48 PM
CHEVY57

If you take probability and add a dose of "Murphy's law" you get maybe, which is the same as saying.........IF (The biggest word in the Englishlanguage) So it ALL comes down to belief.......OR......... not.
10-25-2009, 08:51 PM
99octane

<blockquote> CHEVY57 wrote: <hr> If you take probability and add a dose of "Murphy's law" you get maybe, which is the same as saying.........IF (The biggest word in the English language) So it ALL comes down to belief.......OR......... not.</blockquote>NO IT DOES NOT. Pete, really and truly, you need to understand this! Probability is not the same as "maybe" or "Murphy's law" (which is a concept we invented based on perception) and it most certainly goes WAY beyond "if". For example: IF elephants can fly, and they live in Manhattan, then New Yorkers should always bring an umbrella to work. <img src="http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif"> THAT is a pretty big "if", those flying elephants. But what is the PROBABILITY of a flying elephant in New York city or anywhere else, based on all the observable, testable facts? In the above example, the probability is calculated with known variables, known facts. It would be ZERO. However, the probability of extra terrestrial intelligent life CAN NOT be zero because too many variables are unknown. What IS know however is the abundance of other rocky planets orbiting other stable stars in this galaxy, these are facts by the way, and then the presence of water in liquid state somewhere on or underneath the surface of such a body. It doesn't have to be a planet, some moons, right here in our little solar system show strong indications of liquid water under their surfaces! Given these facts (key word there Pete, facts, haven't said "if" yet) the probability of simple life becomes something you can quantify with X number of planetary bodies with water over an area of X star systems / galaxies. It's at THAT point that your "if" comes into play, but it's plugging an "if" into a known set of variables, a factual set andsubset of real places, and THAT is what sets it apart from the subject you and others keep bringing up and comparing this to. (That which you called "a crock"). THAT is why it is not.
10-25-2009, 09:12 PM
toysalot

Check please...
10-25-2009, 09:14 PM
CHEVY57

ahhhhhh, but IF you had an umbrella in NY, the probability of it helping you in the case of falling Elephants would also be Zero.......<img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/roll.gif" alt="image"> FYI, I believe that there are way to many planets, moons etc in the universe for one or more of them would have to support life. Notice I said believe. Becausewithout ANY proof, that's ALL we have.................
10-25-2009, 09:21 PM
Charger68

Proof only extends to our current knowledge Pete, as we evolve and plug in more and more sophisticated technology, we will find you your proof and hopefully wewill all be around to see it!!!!
10-25-2009, 09:23 PM
toysalot

<img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/roll.gif" alt="image">
10-25-2009, 09:27 PM
99octane

<img src="http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif"> Falling elephants? Yep, I suppose they'd die mid-flight or fall dead off their perches and out of their nests! <img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/tongue.gif" alt="image"> Yikes, I agree, zero chance your umbrella will help in that case... I was talking about droppings from flying pachyderms! <img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/roll.gif" alt="image"> To answer this: "FYI, I believe that there are way to many planets, moons etc in the universe for one or more of them would have to support life." I'd have to fully understand what you mean. Could you rephrase that please? "without ANY proof, that's ALL we have................. " But Pete, we DO have one proof of life elvolving naturally on a planetary body; the Earth! We are not separate and apart from the universe, we're a naturally occurring part of it. It happened here, the question is, can / has /will it happen elsewhere? The search for an answer to that question is, in this thread, being explored by using the only factual, testable known variables we have. The rest is all of that "if" we keep hearing about, but it doens't require "belief" one way or another. There either is, or there is not life elsewhere. We have no definitive knownledge of any life elsewhere, but the liklihood of such life existing can be quantified using what we DO know. That's what's going on here, nothing more, nothing less. Also, how one defines "intelligent life" may or may or include (or exclude) more than once species on this planet as being "intelligent". <img src="http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/wink.gif"> The point is, since we know it did happen here, and largely understand how it happened here, what's tomake the set of variables that were at work on Earth over the past 4.6 billion years so unique as to exclude the probability of it happening similarly elsewhere, somewhere, somwhen, in this vast universe?
10-25-2009, 09:37 PM
CHEVY57

<blockquote> 99octane wrote: To answer this: "FYI, I believe that there are way to many planets, moons etc in the universe for one or more of them would have to support life." I'd have to fully understand what you mean. Could you rephrase that please? </blockquote>I'm saying that I too BELIEVE in life somewhere else. There HAS to be.. The universe is just tooo large for there not to be. Again I sayBelieve, because that's all we have until there (if there ever is any) proof.

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