What would your decision be....

Oh, one last thing I gotta say... Chris, I LOL'd at your comment about my creating my own work!! Love it! But I'd rather build really beautiful schoolsso the kids don't go wrong in the first place...

Greg- So now im irrational for my opinion? So lets see according to you anyone that thinks differently then you do is irrational? Im pro death penalty but inever called you irrational for your ideas. Just debated with you and gave back what you dished out to me. Then asked you to clearly show the facts. Which younever did instead i get this holier than thou art crap where you put yourself on pedistal and throw a pity party. Sorry bud but thats how a debate works. Youtake a topic share your thouts and then someone counters with their thoughts. Theres nothing irrational about that. It how it works.<br><br>"They just become angry and then take everything personally and go on the attack."<br><br>Yeah thats not just a statement but also a good thing for you to think about. <img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/wink.gif" alt="image"><br><br>So once again you fail to show why the DP is so bad. Other than you personally dont benefit from it.<br>

<span style="font-weight: bold;">But I'd rather build really beautiful schools so the kids don't go wrong in the first place...</span><br><br>Oh and Greg those schools youd like to build for kids and all these programs you like for helping troubled kids. You know why they dont get the governmentfunding they need? Its because the money is spent on building bigger prisons to house scum of the earth. So theres just one more way LWOP hurts society.<br>

I'm not one for censorship, but I think that there might be a more appropriate level of standard of what benefits society that some of this stuff meet.There's a lotta absent parents out there and a lotta crap young impressionable, maleable minds are exposed to. <img height="15" src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/pacman.gif" width="15" alt="image">And Greg,...........if you're still here, the lowestcommon denominator had been reached pages and days ago in this thread! <img height="15" src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/pacman.gif" width="15" alt="image"><p><br></p>

The higher costs associated with housing the worst<img height="39" src="http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/aktion/action-smiley-060.gif" width="35" alt="image">would easily be offset by not housing those who commit lesser drug<img height="80" src="http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/party/party-smiley-020.gif" width="112" alt="image">and property crimes. <img height="35" src="http://sshare1.familylobby.com/icons/icon_popcorn.gif" width="35" alt="image"><p><br></p>

Nothing more to say about this. If it goes any further it will be about more personal feelings and such which i just dont care to hear.<br><br>The facts have been shown. The negative impact LWOP has on society has been shown. Nothing logical from Greg or Andy has been shown pertaining to the issueother than they personally dont like it and the occasional talk about its not nice or pleasant. Yeah such is the world. Its not always nice or pleasant.Sometimes things need to be done to fix the rampant problems and we cant always let feeling and emotion get in the way of justice and fixing the problems.<br><br>I hope their never is a zombie plague. Id hate to see the "zombie rights" crap that people start preaching about when its time to kill the armies ofthe walking dead with a head shot. If murderers rapists and pedophiles get all this activist support imagine the bleeding heart crap we would have to put upwith when it came to shooting innocent zombies? Then again most activists would have been eaten during the outbreak since they dont believe in owning guns.<br><br>Yikes! You guys better get armed if you wanna be around to debate that one!<img src="http://www.ezboard.com/image/posticons/pi_freak.gif" alt="image"><br>

Justin... I'm jumping back in because I know you to be a brilliant guy, and a good person, and I wish you a long, happy life... so I hope you can take thisin a constructive way...<br><br>My friend, you've got to learn to not take everything so personally and then react in anger...<br><br>Andy... we're ALL the lowest common denominator...<br><br>Greg

LMAO! Actually i couldnt pass up that comment Andy made...<br><br><blockquote> The higher costs associated with housing the worstwould easily be offset by not housing those who commit lesser drugand property crimes.</blockquote>LMAO. So Just set the rest free and have all other sorts of crime running rampant on the streets. Crime that would eventually lead to murder aswell. For what? All so we can be happy with ourselves for not having the DP? That makes sense.<br>

I just checked the results in the various primaries. Hillary is all but toast and will be bringing President Obama his paper and slippers serving as the ladyof the house, the Vice President of the United States. Then things may begin to change for the kiddies of the world! Yee Haw!!!<img height="15" src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/pacman.gif" width="15" alt="image"><p><br></p>

LOL. Greg nothing against you either.<br> I know your a great person too but you need to practice what you preach man. As some members here once told me theres a difference between having an opinionthat you feel strongly about and speaking your mind vs. being irrational and angry. I thank Chugger and Tex Kitty for teaching me that. Nothing taken personalby me other than the rampant disinformation about the DP. Which i corrected and showed in my counterpoint to your response. It became personal my friendbecause you chose to make it personal. But we can argue who said what and how they said it some other day. I do not feel that my position on the DP hasanything to do with my personal emotions. It has everything to do with my ideals and the fact that i believe in justice administered by a system that holds theprotection of law abiding citizens above all other. Nothing irrational or hate filled about it. Bettering the world for those that contribute goodness to it.And purging those that harm the rest of us.<br><br>You may call this an illogical response for the emotion called revenge. But Greg i will tell you this. Not everyone has a straight up personal emotion when itcomes to the idea of justice. Its not like Batman or Mad Max where the hero goes after the criminals that murder because they were wronged personally. Thereare folks that can see what Justice is without having irrational emotions about it (ie fear, anger, hate) Its purely a sense of right and wrong and paying yourdebt back to society in the form of what you took and not about appeasing ones own appetite for revenge. That my friend is far from being irrational andprobably the most logical definition of Justice that anyone will ever give you.<br><br>Later,<br>Justin<br><br><br>

I just don't understand what is wrong with taking a big stump of pine lying some child molesters head on it and choping it off.<br><br>So someone robs a bank.......chop there arms off...... taaadaaa simple simon!!<br><br>Some jack ass breaks into you house and takes everything you spent the last ten years paying for......you should get to snap there head off and watch it forfree on ppv...<br><br>*****I just don't understand why some folks can't understand this is the best way to go, Quick and easy....Forget big jails and prisons noo more, Justchop and throw them in a hole buy buy...........$$$$$ Then we could take alll the money we save and fix the roads and take care of our own that need help.....<br><br><br>*********Chop Chop*******************<img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/tongue.gif" alt="image">

<blockquote> I just checked the results in the various primaries. Hillary is all but toast and will be bringing President Obama his paper and slippers serving as the lady of the house, the Vice President of the United States. Then things may begin to change for the kiddies of the world! Yee Haw!!!<img src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/pacman.gif" alt="image" height="15" width="15"></blockquote>Pardon?? Where do you get your results, the Obama campaign HQ? So far they have one little state each and the two big fish are still too close tocall.<br>Paper and slippers????? For as progressive as you like to make yourself out to be that is one heck of a sexist comment.<br>

<blockquote> <strong class="quote-title">redlines68 wrote:</strong> <hr> LMAO! Actually i couldnt pass up that comment Andy made... <br><br><blockquote> The higher costs associated with housing the worstwould easily be offset by not housing those who commit lesser drugand property crimes. </blockquote>LMAO. So Just set the rest free and have all other sorts of crime running rampant on the streets. Crime that would eventually lead to murder as well. For what? All so we can be happy with ourselves for not having the DP? That makes sense. <br></blockquote><p> Okay, we're goin' down the right path here now. Just a bit at a time. No Justin, I'm not saying let 'em all out to flood the streets. Lawshave to change and an investment in the young has to occur (Greg), so there's a lesser chance they'll wind up there. Give those in for lesser thanviolent or sexual or major property or drug crimes an opportunity to get out, serve some community service and smarten up. It works in Canada, communityservice sentences have become more and more popular and are proven to work and lessen the $$$ spent on just tossin' people in the can where they only,ONLY, learn far worse. I have thought other methods for attaining a more desireable society for those cost conscious folks that are far less barbaric than theDP. Check the pedigree of families, any who don't make the desired cut, spray 'em with something that renders them sterile. Hey, no killin'goin' on. Just a little preventative medicine for society. <img height="15" src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/pacman.gif" width="15" alt="image"></p>

I have another idea. In Canada, there are about 6 major banks. Together, they are running away with 100s of billions of dollars profit year after year. I sayshut them all down, seize the assets, set up 1 giant Community Credit Union, and spend the reduced profits on social things like the Old Age Homes in Ontarioand elsewhere that are in serious $$$ difficulty, or better schools and food programs for all just like they have in England, or access for lower income peopleto be able to borrow to buy a modest house and become enfranchised in society. I attended school in England as a child, and the diff between here and therewas and is so worlds apart. They too unfortunately have been blowing huge $$$ on prosecuting illegal wars in recent years. <img height="15" src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/pacman.gif" width="15" alt="image"><p><br></p>

Andy. Your intentions are well meaning but lets look at this. <br><br> Youre telling me that we should be more leaniant on the smaller fish to have money for housing the bigger ones (scum of the earth type) right? In turn we make the penalty for lesser crimes like theft, burglary, and drug dealers more leniant. In short in stead of being thrown in prison they get to take part in special programs to teach them the error of their ways? Am i with you so far? So in turn this lesser punishment will free up our budget for housing the scum of the earth. Thus making it more affoardable to keep them in for life. And it will lead to better rehabilitating criminals of lesser crimes? It all sounds good. <br><br> How much does this alternative prison program cost and let me know what the success rate is of rehabilitating these criminals. Chances are im willing to bet all the rousources and money needed to rehabilitate every criminal in the US thats convicted of lesser crimes outside of prisons via special programs would be far more staggering than that spent currently keeping them in prison. So again wed simply be putting ourselves through alot more money and trouble then to simply kill the scum and invest the money in community programs to keep them out of prison altogether. <br>

<blockquote> <strong class="quote-title">sverrefehn wrote:</strong> <hr><blockquote> I just checked the results in the various primaries. Hillary is all but toast and will be bringing President Obama his paper and slippers serving as the lady of the house, the Vice President of the United States. Then things may begin to change for the kiddies of the world! Yee Haw!!!<img height="15" alt="image" src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/pacman.gif" width="15"></blockquote>Pardon?? Where do you get your results, the Obama campaign HQ? So far they have one little state each and the two big fish are still too close to call. <br> Paper and slippers????? For as progressive as you like to make yourself out to be that is one heck of a sexist comment. <br></blockquote><p> I'm not very sexist except in a joking manner. If Hillary were to be the one to win the nomination, and a Democrat I am, that would be great, andtherefore what I would have said was President Hillary would have been brought her slippers by VP Obama, but then I guess someone would have then pulled therace card. The presidential election hasn't begun yet, but I'd give you 100-1 odds that no Republican will see the Whitehouse for a very long time, andI dare say neither the Senate or H of Reps. Hillary or Obama will be it, and it looks a lot like it will be Obama. I worked for years in a law firm whichemployed over 45 women. Talk about sexist comments, maybe you've never been in a room full of women having their girlie chats over lunch or coffee break.No bunch of guys in a bar, a sports changeroom, any of the stereotypical guy hangouts, etc....even comes close, believe me on that. They can be aninterestingly disgusting creature in that type of environment!<img height="15" src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/pacman.gif" width="15" alt="image"></p>

Greg!, I knew you couldn't stay away from this thread, you too, like me, still have faith that the monkeys will someday climb outta that rut their in allclobbering each other. Oh Oh, now I'm gonna get it for the monkey comment. For entertainment purposes, here's another of my sweeping generalizationsfor your consideration. Ya know the movie Planet of The Apes? Okay,..........right wingers are those nastier apes dressed in tan leather and ride horses. Leftwingers are the more cerebral type scientific types played in part by Roddy McDowell (ones dressed in darker green). <img height="15" src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/pacman.gif" width="15" alt="image"><p><br></p>

<blockquote> How much does this alternative prison program cost and let me know what the success rate is of rehabilitating these criminals. Chances are im willing to bet all the rousources and money needed to rehabilitate every criminal in the US thats convicted of lesser crimes outside of prisons via special programs would be far more staggering than that spent currently keeping them in prison.</blockquote>The cost, we'll it's a whole lot cheaper than your average Prison term. When you go through an alternative program, you actually pay toplay. Sure the courts have to pay something to have someone monitor you, but you pay towards your programs. Succes rate? Far better than prison returnrates! Without changing and teaching someone, the person never finds change, never learns to change the mindset. If you don't try, then you just do what90% of the courts do today, stack big terms on the convict and toss away the keys. Hardly trying to do anything about anything, but playing the out of sightout of mind, game. Not dealing with it, is living in the 1930's and taking an uneducated route. Typical for the leadership in this country. Victimlesscrimes, shouldn't be doing time. <br>

Here here Chris! I knew you were a guy of substance all along, not to leave out the others. If you give them the info, most of them will come around. It'sa very very contentious and visceral issue. <img height="15" src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/pacman.gif" width="15" alt="image"><p><br></p>

About the victimless crime thing Chris mentioned, a person consuming illegal drugs is the main one. The act of smoking a piece of crack only makes a victim ofthe user. Only when inavailability due to cost drives a person to crime, does any real crime take place, i.e. robbery, theft, even murder, etc......Big timedrug importers get life, although if safe pure lab or pharmaceutical cocaine or heroine was available, the money would be taken right out of the equationreducing various types of crime by up to 50%. Cost to produce 1 gram of pure heroine,.........3 cents,..............yes $0.03, ..............0.03c.Availability of clinical heroine and cocaine to addicts in a region of Soho in England, has cleaned the neighbourhood up, and reduced crime DRAMATICALLY. Thebusiness people are happy, the residents are happy, and most of all, the Police are happy. Everybody is happy because it costs so so little and the results areabsolutely phenominal. All the while the addicts are given their fix and counselled and in most cases, eventually realize and break free. Even the junkie wouldrather just get his fix without all the crime. One way or another, the drugs WILL be in the picture somewhere. Just better in our control and not the mob orthe CIA. Andy<img height="15" src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/pacman.gif" width="15" alt="image"><p><br></p>

<blockquote> Greg!, I knew you couldn't stay away from this thread, you too, like me, still have faith that the monkeys will someday climb outta that rut their in all clobbering each other. Oh Oh, now I'm gonna get it for the monkey comment. For entertainment purposes, here's another of my sweeping generalizations for your consideration. Ya know the movie Planet of The Apes? Okay,..........right wingers are those nastier apes dressed in tan leather and ride horses. Left wingers are the more cerebral type scientific types played in part by Roddy McDowell (ones dressed in darker green). <img src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/pacman.gif" alt="image" height="15" width="15"></blockquote>Here we go with that left and right wing crap. LOL.<br><br>Love how youve given your allegiance to a label that means nothing. How intellectual of you to divide all beliefs into two absolute groups of thought. Becauseafter all, groups define people and not people themselves. I guess the days of having independent ideas free of labels are all said and gone. LOL then you madeyourselves sound totally genius in your comparison to monkeys in lab coats. Well i guess i have no choice but to label myself so i dont look like a totalmoron. So guess im a <span style="font-weight: bold;">CommunistSocialistRepublicanAfricanAmercaneseCaucasiacanDemocratican</span> !<br>Hows that for a uber intelligent sounding label?<br><br>Yeah we <span style="font-weight: bold;">CommunistSocialistRepublicanAfricanAmercaneseCaucasiacanDemocratican's</span> kick the crap outta both you leftand right wingers! Oooooooooo take that Planet of The Apes and Star Trek.<br><br>Its gone off course again! And Captain Bunny Sparrow aint hoisting the sails to get it back on track either. This ship hit a reef hours ago and is slowly goingdown. Man the lifeboats and prepare to abandon ship! Id abandon it with you guys but Kira Knightly shackled me to the mast and threw away the key. Looks likeim headin for Davy Jones Locker! Yaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrgh!<br>

Trust me Justin, my political allegiance is not to that of any one group. I've been observing the behavioural differences related to a person's orgroup's political orientation for decades. I know what I see. Look for yourself. Even the likleyhood of what either side would do in this discussion isapparent and indicative of exactly what I say. Look! <img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/nerd.gif" alt="image">

Note the word victim less Andy. And what is victim less crime? Rob brought up a good point about how even a simple crime like sticking up a 7/11 can havedeadly consequences. Whats the big fear of punishment someone has to thwart them from doing this and killing the store owner/bystanders in the process? Ooooooolife in prison where they have all the essentials provided. Still not solving the root of the problem with these "programs'. You just help a smallpercentage of convicts get reformed at the expense of creating worse ones. Albeit you do it in a more successful way theoretically but you still leave the doorwide open for the scum to do the dirty deeds without fear of a harsh punishment.<br><br>What if we mad the death penalty standard for scum of the earth types and put the money towards these "special programs" and programs to help lawabiding folks in hard times? Youd be helping both parties that way. Or i guess thats just not as important and im missing the big picture? After all there area great number of law abiding folks that turn to crime because they have no "special programs" to cater to them. Thats a noteworthy issue.<br>

<blockquote> know what I see. Look for yourself. Even the likleyhood of what either side would do in this discussion is apparent and indicative of exactly what I say. Look! <img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/nerd.gif" alt="image"><br></blockquote><br>Look <img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/nerd.gif" alt="image"> I gave myself a label so id be considered intelligent by the apes.Still you arent happy. Are you saying that my <span style="font-weight: bold;">CommunistSocialistRepublicanAfricanAmercaneseCaucasiacanDemocratican</span>veiws are inferior? How dare you! <span style="font-weight: bold;"><span style="font-weight: bold;">We</span></span> <span style="font-weight: bold;">CommunistSocialistRepublicanAfricanAmercaneseCaucasiacanDemocratican's</span> are the self proclaimed superior frontrunner's ofintelligence and you righty lefty folks dont have anything on our superior intellect!<br><br>Take that! <img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/laugh.gif" alt="image"><span style="font-weight: bold;"><br></span>

Alternative programs, have absolutely nothing what's so ever with the DP. I still have a PPV Network to get off the ground here folks! I wonder how muchmoney it would actually take? I figure most people in Government, are currently being bought in the 2-7K range, based solely the latest news, so I can startthere. How many tools on the payroll would this actually take to get on the ballot ( WE get it on the ballot, we're so money)! We'd of course have tomove to Texas, let's face it, if there's a pipeline of talent and a willing regime, it's the LoneStar state for sure-not knockin' it. I hearLake Travis is a great place, and I could get with Austin music scene. I'm goin to talk to the wife tonight. I think we got a winner on our hands.

It has to be made clear to society that possession of any type of object which would be used as a weapon, and particularly knives and guns, will fetch you amajor sentence for even so much as the first offence. Unfortunately though, all guns would have to be removed from society. Out of all the people who want tohave a gun for protection will never use it for that. I have never, nor know of so much as 1 person who's ever had even so much as the opportunity to useany weapon when the proverbial thug is in your house in the middle of the night, or being robbed on the street. Nor get in between waring gang bangers shootingat each other, nor defending Granny from the bad guy. As a matter of fact, try drying out a banana. Once it is dry and black, hang it above your back door onthe inside of the house. I've proven to my friends that this indeed does work equally as a gun in preventing loss of or destruction of my person orproperty. I know that sounds really whack, but I really did do that over a 20 year or so period. And bythe way, it was Chris who mentioned the victimless crimething. There are such crimes, some of which are drug crimes. It is a crime to smoke crack. This is a victimless crime. If a person commits a crime to get moneyto buy crack, that is not a victimless crime in itself. The crack smoker gets some sort of community monitored corrective measure, the person who commits aproperty crime to get money also gets in addition, some form of community service tacked on. The person who uses a weapon in the commission of a crime to getmoney for whatever reason, instant jail, no bail, and a long sentence upon conviction. These people would be forced to work for their living in jail. <img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/smile.gif" alt="image">

Ohhh here we go now its about gun control. Andy how do you suppose we rid the world 100% of guns? Tell me how.<br><br>You know what skip the "how" portion because its just impossible to do it. Just tell me how the world would be less violent and crime ridden if yousomehow managed to magically round up every firearm in existence.

<img height="35" src="http://sshare1.familylobby.com/icons/icon_popcorn.gif" width="35" alt="image"><img height="35" src="http://sshare1.familylobby.com/icons/icon_popcorn.gif" width="35" alt="image"><img height="35" src="http://sshare1.familylobby.com/icons/icon_popcorn.gif" width="35" alt="image"><img height="35" src="http://sshare1.familylobby.com/icons/icon_popcorn.gif" width="35" alt="image"><img height="35" src="http://sshare1.familylobby.com/icons/icon_popcorn.gif" width="35" alt="image"><p><br></p>

I'll get to your question tomorrow Justin! For now, consider this. Not even Ralph Nader can influence the outcome of this election. Reps out, Dems in,unless.........Ralphy pulls off a win, which is really what I'd rather see happen. Andy<img height="15" src="http://redlinesonlinemessageboard.yuku.com/domain/bypass/images/pacman.gif" width="15" alt="image"><p><br></p>

Well then Mr. Nader aside i'll be waiting to be enlightened as to how removing guns (if it wasnt impossible) would make the world less violent.<br><br>Now i gotta hit the gym for a late night workout and make up for sitting on my butt all day debating with you guys. Been told that late May or so (stillspeculative) is when i can expect to ship out date for my luxurious 12 week vacation at beautiful Parris Island. Gotta keep gettin in shape.<br><br>Later,<br>Justin<br>

Oh for god sakes, now you want to rid the world of guns? Thats brilliant, make the law abiding citizens fork over their protection, take away one of theirconstitutional rights, and make it to where only THE CRIMINALS will have guns, as they dont care about the law and wont turn the guns in.

Andy, once again.....come back to planet Earth!!!!! getting rid of guns is not the answer!! i believe it was already mentioned in this never ending and everevolving monster that Great Brittian outlawed guns, and now the use of guns in crimes is out of control. i wouldn't open up this arguement...because youare gonne lose and lose big!!!

Where's Dave?

Wait a minute, Drew is on to something here. Let's start with THE guns, what's next? I've never liked chainsaws in the hands of the wrong guy. Whatsay you about hammers? Oh, cars are very dangerous and kill far more than guns do. Ice picks? Not a very safe tool in my eyes. Bullwhips? A zombie tossenaround a bullwhip is an accident waiting to happen.<br>This isn't the answer.....Bullwhips don't kill, people with bullwhips do the killin! "People" bein the key word in the phrase.

yeah...lets take everyones car away.....yeah..yeah!!!!! while were at it, lets just take away ANYTHING that has the potential to kill someone!! we'll allbe naked sitting on our asses!!!! then maybe Andy would be happy....or maybe not. i'm sure we'll find out soon!!!

<blockquote> <strong class="quote-title">deputyrob wrote:</strong> <hr> yeah...lets take everyones car away.....yeah..yeah!!!!! while were at it, lets just take away ANYTHING that has the potential to kill someone!! we'll all be naked sitting on our asses!!!! then maybe Andy would be happy....or maybe not. i'm sure we'll find out soon!!!</blockquote><p> Rob, you're a Police Officer, I'm not,.............please speculate as to why it's pretty much unaninmous amongst the members of The PoliceChiefs Association of Canada and some politicians as to why they want all handguns taken away and why they want every gun owner to register their long guns.And the last time I thought about it, I don't remember hearing of someone robbing a bank with a chainsaw! WHY do Canadian gun owners not want to registertheir long guns. Tell me, they have the same mindset as gun owners in the US...............</p>

<blockquote> <strong class="quote-title">adamsredlines wrote:</strong> <hr> Oh for god sakes, now you want to rid the world of guns? Thats brilliant, make the law abiding citizens fork over their protection, take away one of their constitutional rights, and make it to where only THE CRIMINALS will have guns, as they dont care about the law and wont turn the guns in.</blockquote><p> Okay , some of you guys who don't read posts, or don't comprehend what they're reading, where did 'I' say I that I wanted to rid'the world' of guns? Did anyone read what I said about what to do with, and who might have guns, (implied other than Police and Military)? Do me afavour, keep all those stolen and illegal handguns that flood the streets of the US outta my country and from flooding the streets here<img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/wink.gif" alt="image">! Can you do that? No, why not?</p>

Chris and Adam hit the nail on the head!<br><br>First off theres just no way to eliminate firearms from existence. Like Adam said you ban the guns and the next thing you know the criminals become the ONLYpeople armed. You just gave the ultimate power to the bad guys. They dont give a damn about obeying laws. Hell most criminals own illegal weapons with theserial # filed off so what do they care if you make it illegal to posses a gun period.<br><br>Second to banish every gun in existence wouldnt it require a government entity that is armed to collect the weapons? Theyd have to be armed to battle it outwith irate citizens that didnt want to give up thier constitutional rights. So now you have a full blown war in the U.S. AND EVERY OTHER NATION between peopletrying to collect the weapons and civilians not wanting to give in. It would be a total bloodbath! Now lets say this global entity finally was able to round upEVERY GUN IN CIVILIAN hands. Now what? You expect them to destroy their own weapons as well? Why should they? Who's to say this global gun collection armyisnt lead by some kind of power hungry wacko thats just waiting to dominate and enslave us all once he has the exclusive access to firearms? So you had aglobal war where millions are killed trying to defend their rights to own firearms for what? All to be enslaved by a armed force in the end. That waspointless!<br><br>So now that its been established theres no way in hell youd ever be able to ban firearms 100% lets discuss why banning them wont make a rats ass difference.Note this is based off the assumption that you could magicly somehow eliminate EVERY GUN IN THE WORLD. Andy the firearm has only been around for a few hundredyears. Some of the bloodiest battles were fought before the firearm was even a idea. People were killed, kings had traitors hung, robbers pillaged and lootedvillages, and god knows what other crimes were committed. And get this.... <span style="font-weight: bold;">these folks never had guns</span>. They had swords.And before they had swords to fight each other they had spears. And before they had spears to fight each other they had rocks. As Chris said theres alot ofthings that could be considered a deadly weapon. So lets say the guns are banned and theres no more firearms. What do you do when people start crafting bow andarrows and rob the mini mart with them? Ban bows and arrows? Well then they start carrying around swords. Now what? Do you ban swords and all knife likeobjects like dinner ware and razors for shaving ? How am i supposed to shave or eat a steak? Now they start crafting knives and spears from sharpening rocksand sticks. Lemme guess what the solution is. Ban rocks and sticks? Hahahaha! What about when we just start using fire as a weapon? Do you ban fire? Yay! Weall get to freeze and die! Sign me up!<br><br>Mankind will manage to create a weapon when he is dis allowed other ones. By banning guns you accomplish nothing other than man turning to other weapons tokill and commit crime with. Theres so many items on planet earth that a person can fashion into a weapon for killing that its just pointless. To be successfulyoud have to lobotomize all of us and stick us in bare isolated cells so we have access to no materials of any sort. The gun did not create crime. Crime washere long ago before the evil firearm showed up. I know your intentions are well meaning but Andy thats just not realistic. We dont live in a Utopian world.Wars are waged and crimes are committed. Maybe if the earth is still standing in a few thousand years it may very well be a 100% peaceful society. But for nowwe have a long way to go before banning weapons is an option.<br><br>And what about zombies? How are we gonna fight the un dead with no weapons? Im not going to be eatin by those puss bags because someone took my right to makeand own weapons away! Uuuuuuughhhhh brains!<br>

<br><blockquote> Okay , some of you guys who don't read posts, or don't comprehend what they're reading, where did 'I' say I that I wanted to rid 'the world' of guns? Did anyone read what I said about what to do with, and who might have guns, (implied other than Police and Military)? Do me a favour, keep all those stolen and illegal handguns that flood the streets of the US outta my country and from flooding the streets here<img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/wink.gif" alt="image">! Can you do that? No, why not?</blockquote><p>LOL. Even better. Congratulations we just give the exclusive power to firearm possession to the government! Now what do we do when they start taking awayother rights and pulling crap like genocide? Ohhh wait we cant do anything because we gave the power away to the government. Yay! Hello dictatorship! Goodbyefreedom!<br></p>

<blockquote> <strong class="quote-title">redlines68 wrote:</strong> <hr><br><blockquote> Okay , some of you guys who don't read posts, or don't comprehend what they're reading, where did 'I' say I that I wanted to rid 'the world' of guns? Did anyone read what I said about what to do with, and who might have guns, (implied other than Police and Military)? Do me a favour, keep all those stolen and illegal handguns that flood the streets of the US outta my country and from flooding the streets here<img alt="image" src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/wink.gif">! Can you do that? No, why not? </blockquote> <p>LOL. Even better. Congratulations we just give the exclusive power to firearm possession to the government! Now what do we do when they start taking away other rights and pulling crap like genocide? Ohhh wait we cant do anything because we gave the power away to the government. Yay! Hello dictatorship! Goodbye freedom! <br></p></blockquote><p> </p> Justin,..............After reading these last 2 posts, I must say a couple of things. First, are you sure you want to join the Military? You reallydo have a phenominal talent for writing and expressing yourself, and are able to add the element of humour. You may not have read a comment I said months agoon the same topic. If and when the Government decides, and if the Military concurs to squash the population, you and all the guns you have in your 2 handscannot stop a tank or other form of armoured assuault vehicle thats sitting outside your front door with the barrel pointed at you and your house, you andyours will have absolutely NO recourse. Now at least my ability to build and fire an RPG gives me an edge on you buddy, but, not even that would be enough todefend myself. You point a gun and fire at them, and you'll draw their fire and be dead instantly, and if you're not lucky enough to die, then thesight of your still connected intestines wrapped around the legs of the table will at least cause you to pass out. That idea doesn't fly any more in thisage of advanced weaponry. What armed vigilant citizenry you speak of was relevant to the formative years of the US and up through the earlier 1900s, but asI've explained, is now an obsolete method of thinking. You, and the boys, bring up some very good arguments, and some that really, deep down, I don'tnecessarily disagree with, don't misundertake me Doctor! I've hunted and fired guns many times. It's kinda fun, although I get bored with it fast.I can understand though that if that's a way a guy gets his fun or whatever, sense of security, that's his thing. I don't have a prob with that.I've always wanted to fire a machine gun, I'd like to have gone down to the Vegas Poker thing. I'm no pansy assed bleeding heart liberal type, Ijust agree with a lot of the propositions on gun control. After all, we are arguing each other on the same side of the fence. Neither of us is the gun toting'criminal' types. Wanna protect your family, read what I said about the Black Banana! I'm very busy today and will be back soon. This thread haspotential. The monster it had become has been wrestled into submission. Andy<img src="http://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/happy.gif" alt="image">