Work Layoffs...

[redlinesrule]

Flat tax?

Basically....yes. Business will always incure a variety of taxes from the government. Look at what Christie has done in NJ after getting in.....lowered taxes & his state is finally starting to see some stability after having one of the worst financial deposits in the nation.

[BlueWag66n]

You guys may have inadvertantly agreed with me. Flat tax means a certain single percentage applicable across the board, part of which would be used to pay down national debt. Just say 10%.

Wall Street tycoon $50,000,000 pays 10% or $5,000,000 tax
Slurpee Server $15,000 pays $1,500 tax

Difference: $4,850,000

Wall Street tycoon lives on $45,000,000 annually
Slurpee Server lives on $13,500 annually

I'm sure the tycoon will not be suffering. Besides, most of his important 'work' is done on the golf course.

[mlbuser]

Sorry in advance I haven't read all of the posts (yet), but the gist seems to be you don't like the government spending, you don't like the government picking winners and losers. Well that's fine, if the economy were doing better I'd agree with you, and bailouts, unemployment, and stimulus spending wouldn't be going on. I don't like nation building or earmarks, we all have spending complaints.

We all agree the government is terrible at spending money. But when the government spends it does create things, no doubt roads are built, bullets made, congressmen get to live the high life, it is real.

My point remains that without government spending, the recession would be worse, possibly much worse.

Has anyone said they want the spending to stop and its ok for the economy to tank? If we remain in recession people will clamp down even tighter, its a vicious cycle. In my opinion its better to maintain GDP at some level until jobs return (people and companies need to see we aren't going to crash). When unemployment drops to 7% I'll be happy to support cutting all kinds of government spending and get back to spending within our means. ~10 years ago we had a balanced budget, it can be done, but don't you think its risky to do it RIGHT NOW. Why can't it wait two years until we're firmly out of the woods.

The argument seems to be short term vs long term good. I think if the short term recovery doesn't happen, there isn't much hope of fixing the long term problem.

[NJ is a work in progress, we have no solutions yet. I hope to get back to this topic, but so much going on this weekend]

[redlinesrule]

All hand outs/bailouts have proved over & over again, is to sustain a business/corporation in the short term & never in growth/long term. Things will often bottom out & then recover when managed correctly but, by our government throwing an endless amount of non existent $$ at something, will never resolve anything. All you have to do is research history on this subject & it's plain as day.

Smaller government has always stimulated the economy while larger ones plunge us deeper under. This isn't the first time we have had a massive recession & probably won't be the last, but until Washington gets it's hand out & stops micro managing corporations & small business, we'll continue to slide deeper into recession. With all the stimulus $$ they've spent on bailouts, themselves & with restrictions & future restrictions on our free enterprises/corporations....they have truly shown that they don't have a clue as to what they're doing & that's sad indeed.

If a company has to fail or feels threatened that it will, let it manage it's self out & stop writing them blank checks with our money....that's just reality.

[customdave]

Hey Dan. Where do you work? I was briefly an ice cream driver and had all the Ben and Jerry's I wanted. I'm surprized I didn't weigh 400lbs when I worked there.lol.
Dave.

[1Perry]

If the government wouldn't have spent the trillions they did, things *might* have temporarily been worse than it was. It would be better today though. Remember, unemployement went higher with the stimulus than the government claimed it would go without the stimulus.

If we had simply allowed things to play out, it would have been messy but shorter lived. All we are doing is accrueing massive debt and will still have to deal with the problems.

[jmaner]

To use your example of
Wall Street tycoon $50,000,000 pays 10% or $5,000,000 tax
Slurpee Server $15,000 pays $1,500 tax

In this current state of tax, that does nothing to address the debt and the "x" amount owed/citizen for the national debt. That would just be the current year income tax which currently does not meet any type of budget thus our debt. Where is the money going to come from to cover the debt? Tax increases. Who will be taxed higher and on greater % of their income....it will not be the slurpee server. It can not only be the Tycoon either. It will be us that are left in the middle class. I don't even begin to imagine that the tycoon pays his full tax---he has nice accountants and tax lawyers to handle all of that....me I got Turbotax to help me. A 2-10% change may not affect the tycoon in his standard of living but it will affect those that are left in the middle class. We already are heading down a deadly spiral in which SSI, Healthcare, and debt payment will consume most of our national $$$/year. At some time hard decisions must be made.

This may not be a be a popular comment or thought but---for the baby boomers and such---will history remember you and those before you as the greatest generations or the generations that lead us to financial disaster. In my early 30's (still not old enough to run for president), I can't imagine how everything will be paid for and worry what will be left to my kids. I wonder what the elder senators and such will tell their kids when asked how we will pay for this. It may not matter anyway as we may all be speaking chinese at that point at the current rate anyways b/c they will own us. All I can do right now is vote for those who represent what I believe and work to cover my ass for when it all hits the fan.

[BlueWag66n]

1)Where is the money going to come from to cover the debt?

2)I don't even begin to imagine that the tycoon pays his full tax---he has nice accountants and tax lawyers to handle all of that...

3)It may not matter anyway as we may all be speaking chinese at that point at the current rate anyways b/c they will own us...

1)My question is: Does anyone really think that debt will ever be paid? Never!

2)...and has nice little secret bank accounts in tax havens such as Cayman Islands, Isle of Wight, and Switzerland in which to hide loot from the tax man!

3)I've always told my friends who have kids, and I've mentioned it here before,..."Better learn Chinese and teach your kids because everyone's gonna need to know how to understand orders". The imperial west is goin' down in the rising wake of Asia and in particular, Imperial China. Better hope we didn't do them any wrong in the past. Human flesh tastes like pork, and would go nice in fried rice.

[redlinesrule]

I've always told my friends who have kids, and I've mentioned it here before,..."Better learn Chinese and teach your kids because everyone's gonna need to know how to understand orders". The imperial west is goin' down in the rising wake of Asia and in particular, Imperial China. Better hope we didn't do them any wrong in the past. Human flesh tastes like pork, and would go nice in fried rice.

Not without a fight from the west.....been there.........done that. If any American dosen't see fit to defend themselves & this country, shame on them & don't let the door hit ya on the way out.

[wishihad]

Been off work for so long cant remember. On again off again. Dont wait around go out and do something for yourself. the Unemployment only lasts so long. And 1/3 or 1/4 of what ya make regularly. YEA RITE! Its a Bitch but it is what it is. Dont just lay down, go get yourself some!!!!!!!